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Freethought
Association of West Michigan
Meeting Minutes for June 26, 2002, #118
Our current,
corrected and updated, schedule of events and topics is as follows:
JULY 10: "Socialism
vs. Capitalism", to be presented by Frank Girard.
JULY 13: ANNUAL
FREETHOUGHT PICNIC. This will be at Hagar Park on 28th Ave. in
Jenison; Maplewood Pavilion, starting at 12 noon. Bring a dish
to pass, table service and beverage. Don H. will provide maps
to the park at the next (July 10) meeting.
JULY 20: Adopt-A-Highway
Cleanup. This is a Saturday and we meet at 10AM at the Citgo station
on Plainfield between 5 Mile and the E. Beltline.
JULY 24: "The
Federal Reserve Bank", presented by Dennis Murphy. This date
was incorrectly shown as the 28th in the bulletin.
AUGUST 14:
"The Neurological Basis of Consciousness", presented
by Dr. Herman Sullivan.
AUGUST 28:
"Meditation for Heretics", presented by Steve Anderson.
SEPTEMBER
11: "Einstein's Humanism", presented by Geophri Saint.
SEPTEMBER
21: Adopt-A-Highway Cleanup. 10AM, Saturday, at the Citgo (see
July 20 information).
SEPTEMBER
25: "An Evolutionary Approach to Critical Thinking",
to be presented by Ron Palmer. This topic is newly added to the
schedule.
OCTOBER 9:
"The Science of Chiropractic", to be presented by Dr.
Bryan Mikula.
OCTOBER 23:
"Nuclear Disarmament & International Law" (tentative
title), to be presented by Kary Love, Attorney specializing in
civil rights. This is a new addition to our schedule of topics.
Note that
all regular meetings start at 7PM and fall on the second and fourth
Wednesdays of each month. See our website for additional information:
www.freethoughtassociation.org.
It was noted
that the U.S. Appellate Court in San Francisco, CA determined
that the phrase "under God" as appearing in the American
"Pledge of Allegiance" is unconstitutional. This is,
however, a tentative progressive step forward for State- Church
Separationists and unlikely to hold up, even though technically
the court's determination is accurate.
Our topic
for this meeting was to have been "Skepticism & Wishful
Thinking" but its presenter had a last minute conflict so
was not able to attend. In his place, Jeff Seaver and Dr. Robert
Collins put together, on very short notice, a tandem presentation
they titled "The Success of Christianity in Modern Culture."
At the outset
it was noted that, as secularists, we tend to find a great deal
of fault with many religious traditions, especially those with
an evangelical approach such as Christianity. We are quite good
at poking holes in scriptural fallacies, criticizing biblical
doctrines and Church dogma and seeing the problems that much of
organized religion has wrought upon the societies they are ensconced
in. But this meeting's tack was to look at what Christianity is
doing right, how it remains successful, and the positive contributions
that this religion has made. It was also mentioned, by way of
introduction, that when viewed historically, there is a very dark
past that abides in the wake of Christianity, so this topic takes
as its general timeframe, the modern era, for investigation and
discussion.
Our presenters
additionally had us look, conversely, at what secularists may
not be doing so well and whether or not we are living up to our
ideals to make a positive contribution to society. We made a distinction,
early on in this discussion between mainstream Christianity and
its Fundamentalist component; the latter being a more visible
"Straw Man", easy to attack out of hand.
We began by
talking about educational institutions that were founded by Christian
groups, medical missionaries and universities that had a good
compatibility with science and secular involvements. Going back
further, we looked at how religions are the general repositories
of a culture's knowledge and talked about the "natural theologians"
and others who saw the signature and glory of God in what His
handiwork: Nature, could tell us by naturalistic investigation.
It was impossible to examine these issues, however, and not make
the point that the Crusades, and other religiously- motivated
acts, great and small, had destroyed much of accumulated knowledge
over and again---Islam, once the envy of the world in some aspects
of science; the Library of Alexandria, and the progress- retarding
approach of Christianity in trying to reconcile natural and scientific
findings with biblical myths such as the Noachian Flood, a literal
Adam and Eve, humanity as a "special creation" and so
on, as just a few examples. It was also noted that even now, universities
with a Christian backing have to toe a certain line and those
academicians who fall outside the accepted boundaries, face firing.
We discussed
how sources of funding for institutions of higher learning have
gone, over time, from churches to businesses and that the resulting
secularizing of these institutions is more a result of drifting
toward the business funding rather than an actual pulling away
from religion.
In discussing
medicine, it was mentioned that religious ideals butt up against
practical realities; medicine works on the bodies it is administered
to, no matter if they be infidel, Muslim, Christian, or Hindu
whereas beseeching one particular religious group's deity or savior
has little demonstrated efficacy. One member said that Christianity
has mostly hindered healthcare.
We talked
about the voucher system, and a recent win for proponents of this
entangling of State and Church as well as private and public monies,
in Ohio. In this light we looked at the ongoing thrust of Christianity
to control public education and shape it to its ends. This led
us to noting that religiously funded institutions and charities
never operate without "strings attached." Whether it
is seeking conversion or participation into a religious practice
before offering a meal or making certain that the philosophy of
an educational system follows the doctrines and stays within the
boundaries of the funding religious institution, controlling reins
are placed upon the offerings.
As to its
success, it was mentioned that Christianity and religions in general
are a good fit for followers and most people are followers, like
easy answers, comforting stories, and will readily offer up their
independence of mind and action upon the altar of dogma and doctrine.
Religious people are statistically greater financial givers to
charities, but, as was noted, religion has entire institutions
established for a more ritualized tithing and offering of money.
Then there is the guilt factor. The non-religious have no carrot
and stick of reward and punishment to grease the wheels of giving.
Secular institutions that get more non-theist dollars are not,
oftentimes as well promoted. It was further noted that freethinkers
are by nature not the types to gather, en masse, behind any particular
institution (charitable or otherwise) in a lockstep, reliable
fashion. Jeff mentioned how trying to do so was "like herding
cats." This idea was also given as to why there can be dozens
of Christian groups on a college campus and at most one fledgling
freethought one. Christianity lends social, cultural and community-
building aspects to the adherent and an established place to meet
and ritualized reasons to gather. And it was noted, the non-religious
are not prone to proselytizing and recruitment. Gone are the thumbscrews
and stake as tools for conversion, but other strong tactics abide.
No one comes to your door during dinner to tell you the "Good
News" of atheism.
We got into
the negative connotations for many regarding non-belief and the
inevitable misconceptions freely bandied about. This makes it
difficult for many people to know there even exists a viable,
vibrant and positive alternative to the brand of religion they
inherited, unquestioningly, from their family. Again, there was
mention of the desire for certainty, a simpler black & white
worldview and having others participate in one's "rightness"
as driving forces behind the success of organized religion.
We talked
about how religiously- funded institutions in other countries
differ from the US. An interesting side note to this was provided
when one person said that in places where Church and State are
more intermingled, the promotion and quality of the religion there
is weaker, since they know they will still get state funding whereas
here the clergy have to work harder for the dollars. Church attendance
is far lower in most other countries, but when asked, most people
in these countries will identify themselves with the dominant
religion.
We ended up
with talk going to politics and the similarities between big religion
and big business and potentially same interests between government
control and church authority. As this was edging quite close to
themes to be discussed in our next meeting, we let it go before
getting too far into these issues.
Secretary:
Charles LaRue
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